India y su industria aeronáutica

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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor polluelo el Lun Sep 12, 2011 5:29 pm

Orel escribió:Hombre, no me creo que los socios no volvieran a invertir nunca, ni en mejoras continuas ni en una gran MLU en su momento. Que la crisis no durará toda la vida y aún estamos con mentalidad de la misma.


Solo faltaria, seria el primer avión de la Historia donde pasara. Ahora bien, hay una gran diferencia entre mantener lo que hay e ir solventando las pegas que aparezcan y seguir desarrollando un avión hasta que no estire mas.

Orel escribió:Sí­, RU e Italia. Por otro lado, Alemania y España han expresado varias veces su intención de adquirir todos.


Ese es el problema, que uno puede negociar de igual a igual cuando está en una situación de fuerza, o por lo menos de igualdad, pero cuando está en una situación en la que la mitad de los que toman las decisiones quieren tomar las de Villadiego no hay igualdad que valga. ¿Quereis salvar el programa? Pues o entrais por el aro o seguis el camino de estos dos. Para ingleses e italianos el programa se acaba por decisión propia, para vosotros dos se acaba por falta de liquidez. Pero la cosa es que sin mi el programa se muere, que sean solo dos no lo salva.

Muy distinto seria que los cuatro paises estuvieran de acuerdo, entonces como mucho podrian aspirar a un puesto a igualdad de nivel que los demás, pero tal y como está el patio no seria de extrañar que compraran a ingleses e italianos su participación y se queden de dueños y señores con mayoria absoluta. Y anda que no iban a estar contentos tanto uno como otro de recibir una inyección de millones semejante.
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor Orel el Lun Sep 12, 2011 8:52 pm

pero tal y como está el patio no seria de extrañar que compraran a ingleses e italianos su participación y se queden de dueños y señores con mayoria absoluta.

Qué optimista eres, ¿eh? :mrgreen:
Hala, va a pasar como con AgustaWestland, su A-129 Mangusta y Turquí­a: que les daremos enterito el Typhoon, con todos los derechos, planos, tecnologí­a, pasando a ser un caza indio, hecho allí­ y todos los beneficios para ellos. Se cerrarán las cadenas de montaje europeas y se perderá buena parte de la red de proveedores europea (y con eso, ¿RU e Italia contentí­simas?). Ya que te pones dramático... :wink:
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor polluelo el Lun Sep 12, 2011 10:07 pm

Viendo como está el patio, si, soy optimista. El otro dia se publicó que los alemanes aumentan este año su presupuesto de defensa, pero para pagar el cambio a un ejercito profesional, por la parte de programas el ministro dijo que va a hablar con la industria para renegociar programas y alargar plazos de los que sobrevivan al recorte previsto.

La solución pesimista es que los indios pasen de nosotros y los ingleses y los italianos se salgan con la suya puesto que nosotros no tenemos un duro para nada y los alemanes, como para fiarse de ellos.
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor champi el Mar Sep 13, 2011 1:10 pm

Cable de Wikileaks referente a la venta de aviones estadounidenses a Air India: http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/ ... annel=null
Sep 13, 2011
By Jay Menon jaymenon68@gmail.com
NEW DELHI

An aircraft purchase agreement between Air India and Boeing in 2005 was a scripted plan between the U.S. government and the aircraft manufacturer, according to a diplomatic U.S. cable released by whistle-blowing website WikiLeaks.

The deal, worth $8.5 billion in then-year dollars, was to supply 50 Boeing 777 and 787 aircraft powered by GE engines to state-owned Air India. The U.S. government feared that if the purchase deal was delayed, European manufacturer Airbus might seek to have the sale canceled by devising a campaign against Boeing, according to the cable dated April 27, 2005. Air India's board had approved the deal on the previous day.

“We must be prepared to respond quickly and aggressively to Airbus's efforts to derail the tender on technical grounds, as Air India has already done in its initial press release by dismissing Airbus's protests of seating configurations and delivery schedules,”the cable says.

Information in the cable credits the success of the deal to advocacy efforts carried out by the economic, political, public affairs and foreign commercial service arms of the U.S. government.

“This [U.S. government]-Boeing effort was well-scripted and provided a new paradigm in how to marry USG advocacy with a commensurate level of company commitment at the highest levels,”it says.

The leaked diplomatic cable also quotes the then-Indian civil aviation secretary Ajay Prasad, who told U.S. embassy officials that he expected Public Investment Board (PIB) and cabinet approval process to be completed within three months. “The longer the decision drags on, the greater the opportunity for Airbus to orchestrate a campaign to disrupt the sale,”the cable says.

The acquisition points toward the Indian government's attempt to turn around the two national carriers. “The new government plan is to: strengthen the carriers quickly by expanding their fleet, restore their financial strength and raise their value on the markets, float an Initial Public Offering (IPO) on the bourses and then gradually, privatize them completely,”the cable says.

Notes from Indian embassy officials indicate Boeing executives had informed them the lessons learned from the Indian deal would be used in developing a new worldwide sales strategy to counter Airbus's inroads on commercial aircraft sales. In 2005, while Air India finalized the purchase of 50 Boeing aircraft, Indian Airlines also sealed a deal to purchase 43 Airbus aircraft. The cable also refers to the order of 27 Boeing 787s that would help “strengthen the viability of this new aircraft on which Boeing has bet heavily.”

The delivery of these aircraft has been delayed by almost three years, for which Air India has demanded a hefty compensation from Boeing. While attaching strategic significance to the Air India-Boeing deal, which will help “redress the growing trade imbalance between two countries,”the U.S. embassy says the expected $1 billion offsets from the deal can help Boeing “enter into strategic partnerships in co-production in the defense and related sectors.”

The comptroller and auditor general, India's auditing agency, in its report to the Civil Aviation Ministry last week, pointed out the hasty decision taken during Air India's purchase deal from Boeing. “No benchmarks for the cost of the aircraft were set by Air India or the Ministry of Civil Aviation before negotiations were initiated with the manufacturers at various levels. Consequently, in the absence of such benchmarks, the effectiveness and efficiency of negotiations and the price arrived at is difficult to ascertain,”the auditing report says. India's Civil Aviation Ministry, however, has denied these charges.

Compraron aviones sin ni siquiera haber demanda, ni saber cuanto iban a pagar por ellos ni cuando los iban a recibir.

Después de esto, no me estrañan noticias como cuando se le bloqueó a Lufhthansa las operaciones con el A380 allá por abril, o más recientemente se le negó a este avión operar en el paí­s... a no ser que fuera una compañí­a india :twisted:

Y así­ le va a Air India, que se la está cargando el estado por completo: http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20 ... india.html
By Siva Govindasamy

An Indian government report has blamed both Air India's management and the Ministry of Civil Aviation for letting the beleaguered carrier become both unprofitable and debt-ridden.

The state-owned airline has been making substantial losses since 2005 and has racked up debts of Indian rupee (Rs) 384 billion ($8.32 billion) as of 31 March 2010 because of plans to purchase new aircraft, inefficient operations and competition from domestic and international carriers, according to an audit by the Comptroller and Auditor General of India.

Despite the government's attempts to shore up Air India, the equity infusion of Rs3.25 billion in 2005-2006 and Rs8 billion in 2009-2010 were a "mere drop in the ocean", it said in the report that was presented to the country's parliament on Thursday, 8 September 2011.

The problems first stemmed from Air India's decision in 2005 to purchase 68 Boeing long-range aircraft and the decision by Indian Airlines, which merged with the former, to order 43 aircraft of the Airbus A320 family. These decisions, said the report, were made without due consideration as to payment or whether there was sufficient demand.


"The entire acquisition was to be funded through debt [to be repaid through revenue generation]," said the report, adding that this was a "recipe for disaster" and "should have raised alarm signals" in the various government agencies.

Assumptions that an increase in capacity would lead to a rise in market share and yields were not "validated" and "unduly optimistic", it added.

The merger of Air India and Indian Airlines in March 2007 was "ill-timed", coming a few months after the firms independently ordered a large amount of aircraft.

Issues such as route rationalisation, network integration, common maintenance and overhaul facilities were not considered before the decision was made, leaving the management to figure these out post-merger and resulted in huge delays in the integration, said the audit.

The single code passenger reservation system was activated only in February 2011. About 98% of the combined workforce has still not been integrated, and the plan to join Star Alliance has been suspended as a result of the problems faced by the carrier.

Much of the fault lay with the Ministry of Civil Aviation, which gave "undue weightage" to the non-financial parameters of the merger at the expense of traffic and operating figures. This unduly presented a "rosy picture of their performance", and resulted in a "lack of effective accountability for all parties concerned". More due diligence could have been done before the merger was pushed through, it added.
...
The report added that there is "no evidence" that the civil aviation ministry provided the airline with "positive support" in the last few years to reduce its debt.

"Aircraft acquisition has contributed predominantly to it [the debt]. The government must lay down a road map for liquidating the liability within a short span after making a realistic assessment of revenue generation capacity. Piecemeal infusion of small amounts is merely going to, at best, delay the certain closure of the airline," it said.

The audit concluded that the government has to take a comprehensive approach to rehabilitating Air India and ensuring its survival.

"Unless the government takes cognisance of above mentioned factors and decisions thereupon, the airline does not have a future as a vibrant public sector entity," it said.

Unos desastres absolutos en cuanto a gestión...
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor Orel el Mié Oct 05, 2011 3:32 pm

Análisis completo, en PDF y en inglés de este año, sobre el concurso MMRCA indio: http://carnegieendowment.org/files/dogfight.pdf (son 150 páginas)

Detalles que destaco, aunque hay tanta información que me ha quedado un ladrillo:

:arrow: Aunque quieren un multirol, buscan primordialmente un buen caza AA:
whatever aircraft is finally selected in the MMRCA competition, its fundamental worth will be assessed first and foremost by its air-to-air performance, with its capacity to undertake precision strike missions being, at least in a relative sense, somewhat secondary in assessed importance

Y lo que se ha dicho más veces: mientras cuente con toda la electrónica necesaria para AS, un perfil aerodinámico perfecto para AA puede desempeñar satisfactoriamente tareas AS:
the IAF has emphasized the air-to-air requirements when evaluating the aerodynamic efficiency of the various MMRCA contenders because of both mission priorities and the reality described earlier: that airframes capable of superlatively performing the air combat mission are likely to be found satisfactory for the air-to-ground requirement as well, so long as the relevant avionics and weapons exist for the purpose. The aerodynamic effectiveness of the six competing aircraft will therefore be judged by the key flight performance characteristics that matter fundamentally in aerial combat such as thrust-to-weight ratios, acceleration capacity, and instantaneous and sustained turn rates.

El Typhoon es mejor caza AA que el Rafale. De hecho, en todo lo último citado (aceleración, empuje-peso, etc.) es superior el Tiffie al francés.

:arrow: Detalles sobre lo especificado para el radar: AESA en banda X, LPI, capaz de detectar una RCS de 5 m2 (equivalente a un caza moderno cargado a tope externamente) a 130 km:
radar systems that possess long-range detection capability against small multiple targets, have a low probability of intercept (LPI), and extreme accuracy at the high relative angular geometries prevalent in aerial dogfighting. The service's 211-page "Request for Proposals", in fact, clearly specifies that the winning aircraft's radar must be able to detect a five square-meter target (a radar cross-section corresponding with a modern, fully loaded fighter) at a distance of some 130 kilometers, or about 59 miles.
These desiderata have led the force to insist on X-band active electronically scanned array (AESA) radars as a precondition for success in the MMRCA competition

Ni los Rafale ni los Typhoon evaluados en India tenían AESA, aunque en las pruebas de "sistemas avanzados" que se hicieron luego en Alemania y Francia estos últimos estarían aventajados (al contar con un AESA en el caza, para pruebas del "F3 road map").

:arrow: También es requisito contar con IRST. (El Rafale ofertado no cuenta con IRST, si no con un visor TV, pega que también vió EAU):
The AESA radar thus remains at the heart of the avionics requirement in the MMRCA competition. However, the IAF has also insisted in its Request for Proposals that all contenders integrate a passive infrared search and tracking (IRST) sensor into their airframes—a requirement based on the service's experience operating Russian platforms like the MiG-29 and the Su-30MKI.

:arrow: En cuanto a la suite EW, India exige: RWR de banda amplia, interferidor DRFM, MAWs con detector IR y señuelo remolcado. A destacar que el Typhoon actualmente cuenta con un MAW pero no IR, si no radar doppler (aunque tiene a disposición el PIMAWS, que sí­ es IR), y que el Rafale ofertado sí­ cuenta con un MAW basado en detectores IR (DDM-NG), pero no tiene señuelos remolcados.
Accordingly, the "Request for Proposals" specifies a requirement for an advanced DAS (defensive avionics suite) that includes: a wideband RWR, a DRFM jammer, an ATRD (active towed radar decoy), and a MAWS with an infrared detector.

:arrow: También exigido que tengan pod FLIR/LD integrado para el rol AS (editado: mucho mejor el Litening que el Damocles):
The IAF requires all the MMRCA candidates to present advanced targeting pods as part of their sensor offerings in support of the air-to-ground role. Where the American airplanes and the Swedish Gripen are concerned, the quality of the targeting pod offered becomes even more significant because the absence of an organic IRST system on these aircraft can be compensated only by including this capability in a pod system.

:arrow: En cuanto a armas AS, les importan más las armas para ataque lejano, de interdicción, frente a objetivos potentes, que las armas "ligeras" y de corto alcance para CAS.
For reasons of cost and utility, as well as doctrinal proclivities, the IAF has not focused on close air support weapons but rather on those most eff ective for battlefield air interdiction operations and deep penetration and strike missions at theater distances.

:arrow: Sobre SEAD, no han pedido armamento dedicado para el MMRCA, lo que hace sospechar que se encargarán más bien los Su-30MKI con misiles AS-17 y/ó UCAVs:
Interestingly, the IAF has not solicited any weapons designed specifically for the SEAD mission, which suggests that it intends to use either its strike unmanned aerial vehicles or the AS-17 missile, associated with the SU-30MKI, for this purpose.

:arrow: Una explicación breve y sencilla sobre alcances y fuel-fraction, restando importancia a éste último y encumbrado factor:
a larger fuel fraction is not always necessarily better, especially in WVR air combat. The Su-30MKI, for example, has a massive internal fuel capacity of more than 20,000 pounds, in contrast to, say, an F-16C's 7,000 pounds. The former, however, would be an extremely sluggish airplane if it entered a dogfight with its full fuel load. In fact, the turning performance of the Su-30MKI improves dramatically as it transitions from a 75 percent to a 50 percent to a 25 percent fuel capacity and, hence, it is rare for these aircraft to undertake air combat missions with more than 50 percent fuel on board.

The most nimble fighter aircraft, in fact, are designed on the assumption that they would have relatively low fuel levels when entering combat. At low fuel states, they can pull more Gs to the benefit of their sustained turn capacity. The real test of mission performance, then, is not so much fuel capacity per se, but whether the aircraft, given its native fuel fraction, can execute its assignments adequately in a specific geographic environment.

:arrow: El radio de combate aproximado del MMRCA debe ser de unas 350 millas (630 km). (Recuerdo que el radio ideal del Typhoon es de 380 millas, 700 km, para ser superior a todo). Idealmente sólo con combustible interno tanto para AA como AS. La pega es que son conscientes de que eso es pedir mucho a los multirol actuales, así­ que tendrán que contar con depos externos:
In practice, this implies that the aircraft must be capable of mission radii on the order of 350 miles so as to be able to operate unfettered over eastern and central Pakistan. The requirements with respect to China, surprisingly, are comparable... Executing these missions also requires aircraft with an operating radius of some 350 miles. Any operations beyond this range will likely be conducted either by the longer-legged Su-30MKIs or India's conventional missile forces.

Ideally, mission performance in the 350-mile range with respect to both Pakistan and China would be serviced by all aircraft entirely on the strength of their internal fuel fraction. Dedicated strike aircraft may in fact be capable of such an achievement, but contemporary multi-role aircraft usually are not. Consequently, it is doubtful whether any of the multi-role aircraft in the MMRCA competition could meet the 350-mile criterion in the air-to-air and air-to-surface regimes on the basis of their internal fuel fractions alone, though all of them could do so when equipped with external tanks and, obviously, when assured of air-to-air refueling.

:arrow: Sobre retornos tecnológicos exigidos: el 50%:
Not surprisingly, the IAF and the Indian defense establishment view the MMRCA competition as providing them with a critical opportunity to leaven the country's aviation capabilities through substantial technology transfers, especially in those arenas where India still lags behind the major powers. This invigoration is expected to occur in two ways: through off sets and through direct knowledge transfers in manufacturing and assembly.

The Indian Ministry of Defense has already levied the most demanding off sets requirements for the MMRCA race. Unlike the standard condition, which requires foreign suppliers to plough back 30 percent of the procurement value through either direct purchases of Indian products or direct investment in Indian defense industries or organizations engaged in defense R&D, the MMRCA contract demands a whopping 50 percent of the deal's final foreign exchange expenditure to be invested in building up Indian defense capabilities.

:arrow: Una explicación sobre porqué el mantenimiento es diferente entre cazas rusos y yanqui-europeos:
Where life cycle costs are concerned, American and European aerospace companies enjoy the greatest advantages over their Russian counterparts because the higher labor costs in the West have induced them to build airplanes that are much more economical to maintain and operate. The more sophisticated levels of aviation technology present in the United States and Europe have also resulted in the use of equipment with greater mean times between failures, thus further reducing life cycle costs.
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor champi el Mié Oct 05, 2011 7:40 pm

Más contradicciones desde la India. El FGFA va a ser mayoritariamente monoplaza: http://ibnlive.in.com/news/iaf-to-induc ... 940-3.html
New Delhi: The Indian Air Force (IAF) will induct a total of 214 single and twin-seater variants of the advanced Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA) being developed jointly by India and Russia. The fighters are likely to be inducted by 2017.

"We are looking for 166 single seater and 48 twin-seater versions of the aircraft," IAF Chief Air Chief Marshal NAK Browne said in New Delhi.
...

Y cómo no, más retrasos para el LCA: http://ibnlive.in.com/news/lca-project- ... 942-3.html
New Delhi: India's ambitious project to develop indigenous Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) has suffered a setback as the Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) for the aircraft was delayed by another year.

"As far as LCA is concerned, there was an initial IOC in January this year. We were supposed to get the IOC (final) by the end of this year. As we see it, there is a delay of almost an year in that," IAF Chief Air Chief Marshal NAK Browne told a press conference.

The delay in IOC is expected to further affect the Final Operational Clearance (FOC) of the aircraft, which was expected by 2012.
...
Replying to a query on M-MRCA as whether IAF will get more funds from the government in view of the high costs of both the shortlisted aircraft, Browne said "money is not an issue."

Talking about the next step in acquistion of M-MRCA, Browne said, "the meeting of Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) will take place on October 7 and we are hopeful that the final bids would be opened by the third or four week of this month."
...
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor champi el Vie Oct 07, 2011 6:31 pm

Se acaba la cuenta atrás para el MMRCA: http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articl ... inner.html
(Source: IBN Live; posted Oct. 7, 2011)

NEW DELHI --- The Defence Acquisition Council will decide on Friday which company will be given India's over $10 billion Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) deal. The race to supply for 126 fighter jets is between two European offerings - the French Rafale and the Eurofighter Typhoon, manufactured by a European consortium.

The Eurofighter and the Rafale are relatively new aircraft and according to the IAF state of art. The Eurofighter has entered service with six air forces in the last few years and the Rafale is in service with the French Air Force.

India urgently needs more fighters and the new planes will take 10 years to come, even after the deal is signed.

The IAF wants to begin induction of the MMRCA in its fleet by 2015, by when it will start phasing out the Soviet-era MiG series of fighter jets. (ends)
...

Mientras tanto, otro accidente más de un MiG-21: http://livefist.blogspot.com/2011/10/ia ... -year.html
Friday, October 07, 2011
IAF MiG-21 Crashes, Third This Year

An IAF MiG-21 crashed today in the Uttarlai-Barmer sector of Rajasthan. The accident happened during the landing phase of a training sortie. The pilot ejected safely and has reported a technical snag. A court of inquiry has been ordered.
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor Orel el Sab Oct 08, 2011 4:26 pm

Se acaba la cuenta atrás para el MMRCA

A ver...

Pues aprovechando la cercaní­a pongo un segundo y último ladrillo de selecciones sacadas de aquél documento en que analiza el programa MMRCA a fondo: http://carnegieendowment.org/files/dogfight.pdf

:arrow: Da una definición concreta de lo que es "supercrucero" para la USAF desde el punto de vista del Raptor: volar a mach 1.5 o más sin PC durante periodos sostenidos con carga de combate: proviene de http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/d ... 991378.htm
El Raptor puede volar a Mach 1.78 sin PC, y por eso alegan que otros como el Tifón, cuyo supercrucero es "sólo" a Mach 1.2 (oficialmente), no son supercruceadores. Aunque en el texto indica que el Eurofighter es el que más se acerca a esa definición de entre todos los contendientes del MMRCA:
"In the context of the F-22 Raptor, supercruise is defined as the ability to cruise at speeds of one and a half times the speed of sound or greater without the use of afterburner for extended periods in combat configuration." By this standard, none of the aircraft in the MMRCA race possess supercruise capabilities, although the Typhoon comes closest in this regard.


:arrow: Un fragmento de una tabla comparativa. Dan datos de carga de combustible, algo poco común de ver:

Imagen

:arrow: Sobre el Rafale, sus costes y de la modernización del Mirage 2000H:
For all its impressive qualities, the Rafale is a likely to be an extraordinarily expensive aircraft, costing somewhere in the region of $85 million a copy, second only to the Eurofighter. The continual upgrades that Dassault has proposed to bring the aircraft up to F3+ standards has, therefore, perplexed many industry observers because the smaller French aircraft production runs already raise unit costs considerably above their foreign counterparts. This ends up making the Rafale costly to begin with, which partly explains why it has lost out in every foreign competition thus far. Attempting to compensate for this outcome by incorporating more sophisticated technology ends up making the airplane even more expensive, especially compared with other twin-engine fighters that provide comparable capability at lesser cost. European industry sources also emphasize the Rafale's high maintenance requirements, which are certain to add significantly to its life cycle costs.

Disadvantage of the Rafale: High maintenance burdens [burden = carga, ser una carga]
...
In any event, the incredible costs of the Mirage 2000 upgrade program—believed to now run at more than $35 million per aircraft—only highlights the traditional weakness of French combat aviation, namely its atrociously high prices that produce a poor cost-to-value ratio.

Desconfí­an de que por parte de Dassault vaya a haber transferencia tecnológica efectiva porque:
India's experience with the Mirage 2000 has shown that, while the French have been very good in providing spares and support for their aircraft, even aircraft maintenance has yielded little by way of true transfers of either knowledge or expertise.

Ventajas polí­ticas del Rafale:
The purchase of a French aircraft could be quite attractive to India on political grounds because Paris has been one of New Delhi's strongest supporters in the international arena. Moreover, French sales of military technology to India have never been subject to cutoffs or sanctions and, hence, would remain a source of reassurance to New Delhi in politically uncertain times. It is far from clear, however, that this past performance is enough to warrant a reward in the form of a MMRCA purchase, given that other big orders, such as the Scorpene submarine and the European Pressurized Reactors (EPR) have already gone to Paris.

- Sobre furtividad radárica, del Rafale, el documento destaca que tiene la menor RCS de todos los presentados.

- Dice que el Rafale F3+ (Tranche 4) tendrá IRST, aunque es un error, ya que el OSF-IT serán sensores ópticos CCD TV. Y cita su carencia de señuelos remolcados.

- Destaca que tanto EFA como Rafale tienen sus AESA aún sólo en evaluación, no operativos.

- Tanto del EFA como del Rafale destaca una excelente integración y fusión de sensores.

:arrow: Sobre el Typhoon
Dice que es el más caro pero también el más cercano a lo que busca el MMRCA y el más sofisticado, técnicamente hablando (no polí­ticamente):
Out of all the aircraft, the Typhoon conformed most closely to the Request for Proposals, and in a purely technical sense, it arguably remains the most sophisticated airplane in the mix

- Destaca dos factores operativos relevantes para la India: su capacidad demostrada para operar desde pistas "cortas" y su buen desempeño en condiciones alto y cálido. Algo que en lo que el Rafale está muy por detrás.
It [the Eurofighter] also exhibits striking short takeoff and landing performance.

Y sobre supercrucero:
In fact, the Eurofighter remains the only aircraft among the MMRCA competitors to have demonstrated some sort of supercruise capability (though this capability falls far short of the sustained supercruise capability of the F-22A and the F-35). (Nota: ¿El F-35? Eso es un fallo.)

Y también:
"In the context of the F-22 Raptor, supercruise is defined as the ability to cruise at speeds of one and a half times the speed of sound or greater without the use of afterburner for extended periods in combat configuration." By this standard, none of the aircraft in the MMRCA race possess supercruise capabilities, although the Typhoon comes closest in this regard.

Sobre su interfaz MMI:
and permits the pilot to control most functions through voice inputs (with the exception of weapons launch). (Nota: El Typhoon es el único del concurso con interfaz VTAS (DVI), más visor de casco y novedoso equipo de vuelo los cuales tampoco tiene el Rafale.)

Sobre el PIRATE:
[El Typhoon cuenta] with a superb IRST system—possibly the world's best—called the Passive Infra-Red Airborne Tracking Equipment (PIRATE). The PIRATE system is capable of detecting targets at distances approaching that of conventional radars. It combines a long-range IRST sensor operating in the long-wave infrared band with a FLIR thermal imager that is capable of passively searching, tracking and designating targets for weapons launch.

Sobre el DASS:
The principal weakness of this system (DASS) currently is the lack of a DRFM-based jammer, but the Eurofighter consortium expects to incorporate this capability in the future.

¿Que el interferidor del DASS no cuenta con DRFM? Eso es falso.
De documento oficial de Selex Galileo sobre el DASS:
The ECM incorporates Digital Radio Frequency Memory (DRFM) technology and provides a comprehensive range coherent and non coherent jamming techniques.
...
• Fully integrated ESM/ECM Comprehensive range of DRFM based coherent and non coherent ECM techniques including anti monopulse.

http://www.selex-sas.com/EN/Common/file ... torian.pdf

Y de la RAA nº 769 de diciembre de 2007: http://www.portalcultura.mde.es/Galeria ... 9_2007.pdf:
Sobre el DASS:...
Mejora 3: Mejora de las DRFM (Digital Radio Frequency Memory) del subsistema ECM “on board”, con aumento de su potencia radiada efectiva, reducción de espúreos y refinado de las técnicas de perturbación y engaño.

Esa mejora se le está incluyendo a todos los Tranche 2 como parte de la P1Ea, y si es una mejora es que, obviamente, el DASS desde antes ya contaba con esas DRFM.
Y otra fuente:
[Sobre el DASS] ECM: Fully integrated and automated electronic counter measures system with same spherical and frequency coverage as ESM. Using DRFM, a technics generator and PESA. The system can jam multiple threats simultanously.
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/i ... topic=19.0


Sobre transferencia de tecnologí­a de EADS: que no serí­a tanta como se dice, muy posiblemente, y que Alemania podrí­a darles algunos EFAs suyos como hizo RU con A. Saudita (aunque comete un gran error: los 72 Tifones sauditas no provienen del pedido a RU, sólo los primeros 24. Y en teorí­a estos serí­an recontratados... si firmaran una T3B):
Although many European diplomats have blithely asserted that transferring highend aviation technology to India “will not be a problem,”such claims must be taken with a pinch of salt. Because the Typhoon is produced by a fourcountry consortium, each with different strengths, different political interests and different responsibilities, securing agreement on an extensive technology transfer package to India will be more difficult than the casual commentary sometimes suggests.
This remains true despite the fact that Germany is the lead country responsible for the Eurofighter Consortium's India campaign. If the Typhoon wins the MMRCA competition, it is likely that the aircraft off ered to India will be taken from the Luftwaffe's planned acquisition in much the same way that the 72 aircraft sold to Saudi Arabia came from the Royal Air Force's allotment.

Sobre coste del EFA y ventajas polí­ticas:
The Typhoon remains the most expensive aircraft in the MMRCA competition, coming in at close to $125 million a copy.
...
Adding to these disadvantages is the fact that purchasing the Typhoon would produce few obvious political benefits. While New Delhi has good reason to maintain strong relations with the United Kingdom and Germany, the imperatives for deepening a partnership with Italy and Spain—particularly through defense purchases—are less pressing. Given these considerations, the Eurofighter Typhoon may ironically end up being devalued, despite its technical effectiveness, for economic and political reasons that in this case are simply not trivial.

- Sobre furtividad radar, el documento destaca que la RCS del EFA es elevada dentro de ser reducida, desde luego su RCS es mayor que la del Rafale.

- El documento ignora en todo momento, cuando habla de maniobrabilidad y de CFT (como cita en el capítulo del F-16 IN), que el Typhoon ofertado tiene TVC y CFT (el Rafale sólo CFT).

- Destaca que tanto EFA como Rafale tienen sus AESA aún sólo en evaluación, no operativos.

- Tanto del EFA como del Rafale destaca una excelente integración y fusión de sensores.

:arrow: Conclusiones tras comparar todos los competidores (aunque sólo quedan Rafale y Typhoon): el Typhoon es el que más se acerca a lo que buscan:
The Typhoon, perhaps, has an edge here mostly because of its excellent human factors engineering. All four aircraft diff er, however, in the area of radar cross-section reductions. The two smaller aircraft, the F-16IN (without its conformal tanks) and the Rafale, appear to have the smallest radar cross-sections nose-on in comparison with the F/A-18E/F and, certainly, the Eurofighter.
...
The IAF would prefer to acquire U.S. munitions as long as it was aff orded access to the best variants and had no reason to fear about reliable access to supply.
...
When these competitors are considered on balance, the Eurofighter probably edges to the top of the final four in terms of overall sophistication, but barely. Despite its present lack of an AESA radar, its sophisticated sensors and avionics will improve with time. Its short takeoff and landing performance and its supercruise capability are relevant operational benefits. Its weapons bring new capabilities to the IAF (even if the best are not released to India or if those released do not always match the best possessed by the United States). And its swing-role capability enables it to shift effortlessly from aerial combat to anti-surface operations.

Against these advantages, however, must be considered its relatively large radar cross-section, which could prove disadvantageous in many combat situations. Yet it is a relatively young aircraft and so has considerable opportunities for growth. The Typhoon, too, comes closest to the static requirements of the MMRCA Request for Proposals, or at least appears able to comply with them with fewest changes.

:arrow: Sobre mejor integración y fusión en cazas "occidentales":
Western aircraft gain dramatic advantages over their Russian and Chinese counterparts because they incorporate better sensors and more eff ectively fuse the information derived from them to ease the pilot's workload amidst the rigors of combat. This capability derives ultimately from the West's superiority in electronics, software, and systems integration.

:arrow: Sobre mantenimiento y apoyo logí­stico rusos (del Mig-29/Mig-29K que opera la India y del Mig-35):
Disadvantage of the Mig-35: Horrendous maintenance requirement.
....
Given extant Russian advantages in aircraft production, however, the MiG-35 is likely to be among the cheaper aircraft on offer, probably coming in somewhere around $45 million a copy. Against this fact, Russia's abysmal record of delivery performance, its perennial difficulties in providing after-sales support, and the high maintenance and life cycle costs of Russian aircraft, will have to be factored in as well.

:arrow: Sobre CFT y radar del F-16 IN:
The F-16IN, based on the Block 60 version developed for the UAE,... is equipped with conformal fuel tanks that alter the distinctive profile of the aircraft, boosting its range but, unfortunately, also reducing its aerodynamic performance. The presence of the conformal tanks results in close to a one-third increase in the aircraft's internal fuel capacity, without depriving it of the ability to carry other external tanks as well. Although the conformal tanks do not noticeably add to the aircraft's drag —a tribute to their design— they contribute to its increased weight when loaded with fuel. This weight gain ends up reducing the F-16IN's otherwise superb maneuverability,...
When equipped with conformal fuel tanks, the F-16IN's aerodynamic performance drops noticeably across all parameters, save range, suggesting that this configuration is unlikely to be favored in any scenario involving air-to-air combat.

Against a one square-meter radar cross-section target in the forward hemisphere, the AN/APG-80 is estimated to have a detection range of some 95 km in both lookup and lookdown modes. The radar can also maintain track files on up to 20 targets, while supporting four simultaneous engagements.

:arrow: Sobre el SuperHornet:
While the F-16 remains the perfect example of a great fourth-generation fighter that has evolved over time to service new roles—its airframe remaining basically intact while its innards have been transformed in revolutionary ways—the F/A-18—which was developed originally as part of the same lightweight fighter competition—has undergone dramatic structural and internal metamorphoses to make it in reality an entirely new aircraft.
The current F/A-18E/F Super Hornet, Boeing's candidate in the MMRCA competition, shares only the designator, “F/A-18,”with its immediate predecessor, the F/A-18C/D.
...
its avionics and sensors, which no other aircraft save the fifth-generation F-22A and F-35 can match.

Jane's Avionics, for example, suggests that the AN/APG-79 can detect a one square-meter radar cross-section target at some 110 km. One Indian commentator, basing his F/A-18E/F characterization on IAF sources, places the “radar's range against tacticalsized targets at roughly 100 to 125 miles [160‒200 km]

- El SuperHornet es el único cuya envolvente de vuelo está limitada a menos de 9 G's (unos 7 Gs).

:arrow: Y por último, sobre costes unitarios de todos los contendientes originales al MMRCA:
MiG-35 -----> $45 million
Gripen NG --->$82.2 million
Rafale ----->$85.4 million
Typhoon ----->$123.1 million
F-16IN ----->$60 million
F/A-18E/F --->$60.3 million

Un saludo
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor dacer el Mar Oct 11, 2011 5:34 pm

en varios lei que el dia 18/10/2011 se decide el MMRCA, queda poco, asi que sabremos si es cierto lo que lei de ese dia, y a ver que depara

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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor champi el Mar Oct 11, 2011 7:37 pm

No exactamente. El 18 lo que se cierra es el plazo para presentar las propuestas definitivas. Respecto a la resolución, en varios sitios dicen que puede ser a mediados de noviembre, pero aquí­ todos sabemos que las cosas van como en palacio... http://livefist.blogspot.com/2011/10/mm ... w-iaf.html

Ha muerto el jefe de pruebas de HAL (suicidio?): http://ibnlive.in.com/news/bangalore-ha ... 2-132.html
Bangalore: Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) Chief Test Pilot and Director (Corporate Planning and Marketing) Squadron Leader (Rtd) Baldev Singh was found dead in Bangalore on Tuesday. His was body found at tourist spot Nandi Hills at 11 am.

The reasons behind his death are still not known, but police said Singh has allegedly committed suicide.

Sqn Ldr (Retd) Baldev Singh, Director (Corporate Planning & Marketing) of Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, hanged himself from a tree using his turban at "Bramhagiri Betta", part of the picturesque Nandi hills, a favourite tourist spot near here, police sources said.

The sources said Singh (58), wearing a HAL uniform, had left behind the driver of his official car near the international airport and then went to Nandi Hills.

Nandi Hills is a popular tourist destination on the outskirts of Bangalore city.

Singh, survived by wife and two sons, had retired from Indian Air Force in 1989 and joined HAL. He had earlier served as Executive Director (Flight Operations) and the Chief Test Pilot (Fixed Wing) at HAL Bangalore Complex.

He was also involved in the development of the Light Combat Aircraft Tejas by the HAL.

Highly experienced in various facets of aviation, he had a total Flight Test experience of over 6,000 hours on 55 different types of aircraft. He was a Qualified Flying Instructor and held a diploma in Aviation Flight Safety from the Naval Post Graduate College, Monterey Bay, California, US.

He had graduated from the National Defence Academy in December 1972 and was commissioned into the Indian Air Force in June next year as a fighter pilot.

After doing operational flying on Hunter, Mig-21 and Mig-23 aircraft, he qualified as a Flight Instructor in July 1983, and was posted to Air Force Academy at Hyderabad for Instructional Flying Duties on the Kiran Aircraft.

He was involved with the LCA Programme from 1990 onwards and was deputed to the Aeronautical Development Agency for this purpose. On the LCA programme, he worked extensively on the development and flight testing of the flight control laws of the Light Combat aircraft.
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor Orel el Sab Oct 15, 2011 5:01 pm

Resumen de fechas futuras del MMRCA:
So the final stage of the MMRCA seems very clear now (Saturday, October 8, 2011):

- Opening of the bids around October 18th (10 days from now)
- Anouncement of the MMRCA winner between November 7th and November 14th (2-3 weeks to calculate the lowest bid)
- Contract signed before the end of 2011 (as announced by India Defense Minister)
- First deliveries by late 2014, early 2015 (36 months after the contract is signed)

Fuente: http://rafalenews.blogspot.com/2011/10/ ... -days.html

Y complemento citándome a mí­ mismo:
- Esperan que las entregas comiencen en Diciembre de 2014 y tener el primer escuadrón a finales de 2015, un año después.

- Los primeros 18 aviones (el primer escuadrón) llegarán ya construidos, los siguienes 108 serán fabricados en India. El primero de los indios podrí­a estar listo en Diciembre de 2016.

- Las ofertas de EADS y Dassault llegarán en Julio (2011) y esperan firmar el contrato en Diciembre de este año 2011. Hacen sus cálculos para un ciclo de vida del caza de 40 años.

Fuente: http://www.defencetalk.com/india-mmrca- ... z1NEJjZnfo
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor Orel el Jue Oct 27, 2011 12:21 pm

India ha elegido el AH-64D Apache, rechazando el Mi-28N.
Comprará 22 Apaches (con opciones por otros 22), los cuales demostraron mejores prestaciones que los Havoc. Además, el helo ruso no cumplí­a 20 de los requisitos.
IAF selects Boeing's Apache Longbow combat helicopter for chopper tender
Read more: http://www.defencetalk.com/iaf-selects- ... z1cGbmMvwX

Russia loses $600 mln Indian attack helicopter tender
25/10/2011
NEW DELHI, October 25 (RIA Novosti)

Russian Mi-28N Night Hunter has lost a tender on the delivery of 22 attack helicopters to the Indian military in strong competition with the American AH-64D Apache, an Indian Defense Ministry source said on Tuesday.

“We decided not to choose the Mi-28 for technical reasons. Our experts believe that the Mi-28N did not meet the requirements of the tender on 20 positions, while the Apache showed better performance,”the source said.


The future contract, worth at least $600 million, envisions an optional delivery of additional 22 helicopters.

Russia is still taking part in two other Indian helicopter tenders: on the delivery of 12 heavy transport helicopters and 197 light general-purpose helicopters.

Mi-28N Night Hunter: The main attack helicopter of the Russian Air Force

The first tender includes the Russian Mi-26T2 and the American CH-47F Chinook helicopters, while the second involves the Russian Ka-226T and the AS550 Fennec helicopter, developed by Eurocopter.

Meanwhile, Russia continues the deliveries of Mi-17-B5 transport helicopters to India under a 2008 contract for the supply of 80 helicopters worth $1.4 billion.

The Indian military helicopter market, with its potential demand for 700 helicopters in the next decade, fuels fierce competition among foreign manufacturers.

http://en.ria.ru/world/20111025/168096811.html
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor Orel el Mar Nov 01, 2011 7:59 pm

Más cerca...:
MMRCA Bids To Be Opened On November 4
Monday, October 24, 2011

the final commercial bids in India's $12-billion Indian medium multirole combat aircraft (MMRCA) competition are to be opened on Friday, November 4. The two finalists, Dassault and Eurofighter, were contacted this week seeking their presence at the Ministry of Defence on November 4 for the authentication and opening of commercial bids. According to procedure, the contents of both bids will be read out to all present and then signed by all members of the Contract Negotiation Committee.

http://livefist.blogspot.com/2011/10/fl ... ed-on.html


Muchos enlaces (ingleses, asiáticos e indios) en los que se afirma la superioridad técnica del Eurofighter Typhoon en India MMRCA sobre el Rafale:
Antes de la evaluación en India (que fue en primavera de 2010), pero con el entrenamiento previo de pilotos indios hecho en los países de origen a finales de 2009 (el del Typhoon en Alemania), la afrimación del embajador indio en Italia:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/01/ ... arketsNews
"ROME, Jan 22, 2010(Reuters) - The Eurofighter Typhoon is "leading the race" to win a contract from the Indian government for 126 fighter jets, valued at around $10.4 billion, India's ambassador to Italy said on Friday."

Y ya con la evaluación en India realizada:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/news ... -deal.html
"The Typhoon was already leading the pack after the jet scored highest in a technical assessment by Indian pilots who flew the aircraft in a series of exercises in 2010."
http://www.brahmand.com/news/Eurofighte ... /1/10.html
http://articles.economictimes.indiatime ... n-s-gripen
http://www.asianage.com/india/india-eye ... on-7bn-280
http://air-ace.blogspot.co.uk/2011/01/e ... -deal.html
http://www.delhiscienceforum.net/peace- ... ists-.html
http://www.stratpost.com/blog-eurofight ... s-on-mmrca

Y por si alguien dice que en todas las encuestas de foros indios se prefería el Rafale:
http://www.indian-military.org/componen ... mmrca.html

Y estos dicen lo contrario, que fue el Rafale (estos son sólo franceses):
http://www.deccanchronicle.com/channels ... -merit-126
http://www.latribune.fr/entreprises-fin ... -inde.html
"Selon des sources concordantes, les offres de Dassault Aviation et du consortium européen [Typhoon] seraient très proches l'une de l'autre."

Chao
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor Orel el Mié Nov 02, 2011 9:08 pm

Confirmando lo puesto por Champi en el tema del F-35, de otra fuente: ahora EEUU, una vez rechazados sus SuperHornet y F-16IN, sí­ que le ofrece a la India el F-35:
EEUU dispuesto a suministrar a la India cazas de quinta generación F-35
Nueva Dehli, 2 de noviembre, RIA Novosti.

Washington, que perdió las licitaciones para vender a la India 126 cazas, ahora está dispuesto a ofrecer a Nueva Dehli el caza de quinta generación F-35 para afianzar sus posiciones en el mercado de armas del paí­s surasiático, según el informe del Pentágono, citado hoy la prensa hindú.

http://sp.rian.ru/Defensa/20111102/151407705.html
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Re: India y su industria aeronáutica

Notapor Orel el Vie Nov 04, 2011 4:13 pm

MMRCA Bids Open, Lowest Bidder In December
Friday, November 04, 2011

Imagen

The M-MRCA bids are officially open. Senior officials from Dassault and EADS Cassidian were at Air Force HQ for the authentication and opening of bids in the presence of a host of MoD officers including, my sources tell me, DG (Acquisitions) Vivek Rae, Joint Secretary & Acquisition Manager (Air) Ranjan Ghose and Technical Manager (Air) Air Vice Marshal J.S. Panesar.

EADS Cassidian released this statement shortly after the opening of bids: Our offer for India's Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) tender is backed by the four Eurofighter partner nations as well as their respective aerospace and defence industries. It is competitive and designed to deliver maximum value to India. Our proposal to make India a full partner in the Eurofighter programme is fully supported by Germany, the UK, Spain and Italy.

Will update this post if/when Dassault makes a statement.

http://livefist.blogspot.com/2011/11/mm ... er-in.html
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